Episode 18 – Empowering Choices Leveraging Behavioural Science for Better Pet Care

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In this week’s episode

• The Impact of Behavioural Science on Client Communication: Rebecca Maher highlights that by applying principles of behavioural science, such as social proof and anchoring, veterinary practices can significantly influence client decision-making and perceptions. For instance, presenting the value of a treatment before discussing its cost can lead to higher acceptance and satisfaction among clients.
• Awareness and Integration of Behavioural Science in Veterinary Practice: There is an increasing recognition of the role that behavioural science plays in veterinary medicine, with a growing number of veterinary practices employing behavioural scientists. This trend indicates a shift towards a more nuanced understanding of effective communication, which is likely to become a core competency taught in veterinary education.
• Understanding Behavioural Science: Behavioural science examines how our thoughts, feelings, and perceptions influence our actions. It offers an evidence-based approach to communication, grounding discussions in scientific principles rather than subjective interpretations. This is particularly relevant for veterinary practices, as it allows them to assess how changes in communication strategies impact client behaviour and decision-making.
• Bridging Communication Gaps: Veterinary practices often struggle to connect with clients because they communicate through rational facts while clients are driven by emotions. By applying behavioural science, practices can better understand clients’ subconscious drivers and adapt their communication methods to bridge this gap, fostering more effective interactions and guiding clients toward better decisions for their pets

Transcription

Jack Peploe:

Coming up on modern veterinary practice,

Rebecca Maher:

Put very simply, behavioural science is just the study of what drives our behaviours. So how our thoughts and our feelings, our perceptions affect what we do. And the thing that I really like about it, and I think the thing that is helping it to resonate with veterinary businesses is that it’s very evidence-based. So often when people think about the way that people feel or how we communicate, they start to feel like they’re sort of going off into this really fluffy area. And as that can feel a bit challenging, but actually behavioural science keeps it really grounded in evidence. So you’re looking at if I change this thing about the way in which I communicate, what impact does it have on the behaviour? And it helps us understand the kind of neuroscience that sits beneath that, the reasons why that makes a difference to people when we communicate differently.

Jack Peploe:

Welcome to the Modern Veterinary Practice Podcast. I’m your host and veterinary reality expert, Jack Peploe. In this episode, I’ll be welcoming Rebecca Maher to the podcast who will talk to us about the application of behavioural science to improve client communication and decision-making in veterinary practices,

Rebecca Maher:

The interview. So, hi, I’m Becky Mayer. I’m the managing director of Inside Minds Consulting, and it’s a business really that helps veterinary businesses. Can I start that again? Sorry.

Jack Peploe:

Of course you can.

Rebecca Maher:

I’m so rubbish at this. This can take half an hour. You’ll be so annoyed to be like Becky, let’s move past this. Hi, I am Becky Mayer. I’m managing director of Inside Mind Consulting, and we help veterinary businesses get past the problem of how veterinary practices and clients speak different languages. So veterinary businesses tend to speak in rational facts and evidence, but clients tend to speak in matters of the heart and emotions, and we help to bridge that gap so that clinics can speak more effectively to clients.

Jack Peploe:

Awesome. Well, welcome to the Modern Veterinary Practice Podcast. It’s great to have you on board and welcome you to today. How have you been?

Rebecca Maher:

Good, thanks, Jack. Yeah, how about you?

Jack Peploe:

Yeah, good, good. Bit tired. I’m currently going to pay the pm MS report, which by the point that this comes out, I’ll be probably on a beach somewhere, not thinking about it anymore. I really hope probably not going to happen, but at least you’ll and gone. So yeah, I can’t wait, but no, I’m good, I’m good. So today we’re going to be diving into how behavioural science can transform the way veterinary practices engage with their clients and guide them towards better decisions for their pets. And who better than to have you on board here today with me, help me tackle this fascinating subject. So let’s get stuck in. So Becky, could you start by explaining what behavioural science entails and why it’s so crucial for veterinary practices?

Rebecca Maher:

Yeah, sure. So I mean, put very simply, behavioural science is just the study of what drives our behaviours. So how our thoughts and our feelings, our perceptions affect what we do. And the thing that I really like about it, and I think the thing that is helping it to resonate with veterinary businesses is that it’s very evidence-based. So often when people think about the way that people feel or how we communicate, they start to feel like they’re sort of going off into this really fluffy area. And as scientists, that can feel a bit challenging, but actually behavioural science keeps it really grounded in evidence. So you are looking at, if I change this thing about the way in which I communicate, what impact does it have on the behaviour? And it helps us understand the neuroscience that sits beneath that, the reasons why that makes a difference to people when we communicate differently.

Jack Peploe:

That’s cool. And so what are some of the common misunderstandings or challenges vet practices face when communicating with, for example, let’s pick on clients. How does behavioural science help address that?

Rebecca Maher:

Well, I think probably the biggest one that I see is this kind of human feature that we all have this sort of human tendency to want to, if we’re trying to guide someone towards something, we want them to see things through our lens, see things as we see them, then the sort of human nature thing to do is to say, right, if they just knew what I knew, then they would feel how I feel. And so I’m going to share with them what I know and explain and we explain and we explain or we pull in some more evidence to say why we are right. But the thing is that that’s not what tends to guide behaviour. It’s not what tends to guide people’s decisions. Everything that we tend to do is driven much more at the subconscious level. So decisions tend to be a feeling. We will instinctively feel whether or not something is a good idea. And so if we want to guide people to do something differently or to behave differently or to make a different decision, then we need to think about what is going on beneath the surface. What are the drivers of their subconscious that we can tap into to make that happen? And it’s definitely not going to be explained more or pull in more evidence

Jack Peploe:

Because generally I can speak from a client’s perspective, it goes in one ear and out the other in most cases.

Rebecca Maher:

Exactly, exactly.

Jack Peploe:

And so could you elaborate on that and just give me some examples of some of these specific challenges and how you might go about tackling them?

Rebecca Maher:

Yeah, so if I think about a challenge in the consulting room, for example, where, I dunno, perhaps we were trying to persuade a client that a particular course of treatment or a particular treatment path is the right thing for the patient. Then often we will go to the evidence, the data shows us that the dog will do better if or the cat will recover faster. But actually if we tap into some of the mental shortcuts that clients will be using when they’re deciding whether or not something is a good idea, then if we start to tap into trying to think of a good example. So a good example would be social proof. If we can tap into this sort of mental shortcut that we all have, which is if I see lots of people doing something, then I think it’s a good idea. All those people can’t be wrong, so it must be a good thing to do.

So rather than trying to persuade the client that it’s the right treatment path because of evidence X, evidence Y and evidence Z, which of course they need to know that they do still need to know it’s a good idea because, but the thing that’s likely to push the client over the line and think, oh, actually yes, instinctively I can feel that this is the right thing to do and I’m going to do it, is if that is a treatment path that most people choose or that most people who choose the path feel really happy with, then that will tap into this idea of social proof. If we tell them that, so most of my clients will decide to do X because of Y and they’ll feel Zed as a result, that is likely to be much more effective in guiding them than saying 85% of dogs that go down this path recover faster. Just telling them that it’s a pathway travelled will help to lower that perception of risk. It’ll evoke that subconscious sense. If all of their other clients are making this choice, then it must be the right thing to do. I’m not sure if that answers the question,

Jack Peploe:

Jack. I’m hoping it does. Hundred percent does. But what I was going to say is obviously as vets, I can’t say we, but you guys are aligned in a set way. How do you kind of reprogram someone to be able to take an approach like that? It must be quite a challenge.

Rebecca Maher:

It is a real challenge, and I think one of the challenges I face is that there’s about 11 billion ways in which we can apply behavioural science to improve the way in which we’re communicating with clients. Whether that be through the way that the website looks or whether that be through the greeting people get at the reception desk or their experiencing the consulting room and the persuasive nature of it. I’ve just spoken about the aftercare, there’s just tons of ways in which we can apply behavioural science. So one of the challenges I have is in helping practices unravel, where is the place where we are likely to have the biggest impact? And so let’s start there first, particularly if it’s an easy thing for us to change. So not all the change requires people to change their pattern because I think that’s quite hard, isn’t it for if you’ve been in practice for a while and you’ve got this particular way in which you speak about things, we all develop a pattern, don’t we?

And changing that in the moment, that’s tough to do. It’s not impossible, but it’s tough to do. But some of the changes can be as simple as just changing some of the wording on a website or redecorating your waiting room or cleaning it twice in the morning instead of just once. Or some of those things will actually have a very real impact in what clients impact on what they think and feel and therefore what they do as a result. But when it comes to some of the bigger changes that I’ve just spoken about, let’s just completely change the way in which we guide clients in the consulting room, change the pattern, then I think it’s really helpful to think about making small changes first and to start to feel the impact of that. And then it kind of helps to I guess sort of break down a few of those barriers in terms of if I can make one word change and if I can remember to do it a few times during the day and then I start to see good results off the back of it, then slowly, slowly, slowly we start to feel the change within the team.

So I think that’s the thing is it’s biting off small chunks and identifying where we can get quick wins. And the biggest, I say bang for your buck, but that’s not quite the right phrase, but the biggest impact for the smallest effort, I suppose.

Jack Peploe:

A hundred percent. And I mean following, I watched your presentation, which I thought was brilliant at Vet Forum, and you used an example of expressing value specifically around health plans, I think it was, which I thought was really interesting. And it was just a flip of putting the price, making it less in your face, and also flipping around so that you’re putting actually the value of what you are offering to the top, because obviously that’s the first thing that should be read. C is really obvious and very, very straightforward. And you also referenced actually not always putting the currency symbol there as well or making it smaller, which I thought was really fascinating, but they seemed like really small changes. What was the most interesting change you’ve done that’s had the most significant impact? And I appreciate every VE practice is going to be different, but from what you’ve done, what’s been the most impactful change that you’ve done?

Rebecca Maher:

I guess it depends how you measure the impact, because some of the best moments for me have been watching a penny drop with a team when I’ve been working through something with them. And often people start from the basis of how much can a few words really change how I feel or how much can that really influence my behaviour? There’s this sort of certain cynicism, I suppose, around the impact of individual words on our behaviour or individual kind of actions on our behaviour.

And when I take teams through it and I try and do it in a very practical way so that they’re experiencing it themselves and they start to notice the sort of difference in how they’re feeling and how it affects their own decision making and their own behaviour. And there’s often this moment where you see the penny drop and people kind of sit back and go, oh, okay, just these really small changes, it affects me, so it must affect my clients. And of course it affects all of us. It’s just being human. So I think for me personally, that’s the most nourishing bit for me is when I start to see people really get it and really appreciate how simple some of these changes can be. Because like you said, just flipping things around the order in which you say things or the order in which you present things, it is a simple change.

That’s a really easy thing to do, but the difference in the person that’s receiving it is absolutely gargantuan. So yeah, I think watching the penny drop for me is the most nourishing thing. But I mean in terms of impacts, it’s very real from a business perspective. That example that you mentioned, just moving in a communication about a health plan, moving the price from being the first thing that’s communicated at the top to moving that to the bottom and communicating the value. First one, practice has seen an uplift in their health plan uptake jump from 18% to around about 30%.

Jack Peploe:

Wow.

Rebecca Maher:

Just off the back of making that change. So these things feel small and at a rational level you kind of look at it and think, well, that shouldn’t really make a difference. But the point is is that we don’t perceive things rationally, so these things really do make a difference and it can be quite profound.

Jack Peploe:

There was another one that, sorry to keep on picking your presentation, but it did have an impact, which is cool. But the other one that really caught my attention was the managing the expectation around price, and I was setting that bracket slightly higher. Can you elaborate a little bit more on that one? I thought you also used the reference, you said that you used it and your husband, and your husband was Adam, who’s like, you’re not going to catch me out, and you called him out, which I thought was brilliant, but can you elaborate a little bit more on that?

Rebecca Maher:

Yeah, sure. So that’s the principle of anchoring. So anchoring is it’s basically the tendency that we have to use the first bit of information that’s shared with us as sort of an anchor point, and then we’ll compare everything else that’s communicated to us back to that subconsciously we’re not aware of it. And actually just like my husband, as you mentioned there, if you ask anyone, does this affect you? We’ll all be like, no, of course not. It’s completely irrational, never. But it really, really, really does. So I do an exercise in my workshops where I give half of the team one anchor, and unbeknownst to them, the other half of the team have been given another anchor, and they don’t even know they’re being anchored, but I’m just asking them to estimate something. I ask them to estimate how many litres of fuel a jumbo jet takes, and the profound difference in responses. One group that’s been given the high anchor will be say, hundreds of thousands, and the group who’ve been given a low anchor will say like tens of thousands. So it spreads the answers wide, and yet when you show people the results, they’re like, no way.

No way. I do not think this affects me. And it’s been shown over and over and over again in studies that people don’t believe that anchoring works on them. They don’t believe that their subsequent answers will be influenced by a number that they’re given right at the start. They think they’re much more objective than that, but it happens to all of us all the time. So you have to be careful with these things to use them ethically and to use them appropriately. But one of the ways that anchoring can be used very effectively is in that moment when clinics are sharing an estimate and it’s the first time that a client’s getting a feel for what something is going to cost them. And as the team is writing up the estimate, they sat at the terminal typing it away, and maybe they’re starting to get a feeling it’s going to come out at around about, I don’t know, 350, 380 pounds.

And if at that point they say to the client, okay, I’m nearly there. It’s going to come in, it’s less than 500 pounds, I’m just finishing it off now. And then say, right, there you go, it’s 350 pounds. Then what they’ve done then having given that anchor of 500 pounds, means that the client will feel so much more comfortable with 350 pounds because relatively, it’s a comparatively smaller number than if they just said, okay, here’s your estimate, it’s 350 pounds. That would’ve been an immediate moment of ouch for the client. Whereas by giving them the high anchor first, it just makes it feel so much better, so much more comfortable.

Jack Peploe:

What’s going to happen now is pretty much everyone that’s listening to the podcast is going to be super wary of anchoring. Now. They’re going to be preempting it everywhere.

Rebecca Maher:

You know what, even knowing about it doesn’t protect you from it. So I fall for anchoring all the time, and even when I’m, I don’t know if I’m shopping online or something and I can see it, I’m like, oh, there we go. They’ve just anchored me to that. You go to a restaurant and give, there’ll be some highlighted meal, which is much more expensive than the others, and they’re drawing your eyesight into their sort of high anchor and they’re not really expecting anyone to buy it, but they’re just hoping that then that will make the other meals feel like better value. And you maybe spend a bit more than you might’ve done otherwise. And I can see that that’s being done, but I’m still drawn to it. I still feel more comfortable paying more because of it. So yeah, there’s no protection from it unfortunately, which is why you’ve got to use it ethically and not in a kind of manipulative way. This isn’t about helping clinics charge more and making clients feel more comfortable about it. That’s not what I’m in it for. This is about knowing that we’ve set our prices appropriately, honestly, and openly, that then the way in which we communicate it can make it feel a lot better. And why wouldn’t we want it to feel better? I know as a consumer, I would want to feel more comfortable about the price that I have to pay for something,

Jack Peploe:

But it’s also on the veterinary team as well, because I know that price is never a conversation they want to have. So if it alleviates that pressure, I mean, as an industry, I mean, I’ve been in a number of industries before I decided to focus on veterinary, and they are wildly different. I don’t think I’ve come across quite an ethically sound industry as veterinary. It makes it so pleasant to work in. But I have seen the flip side to that. And as I mentioned, this is why I think quite a number of practices are going towards health plans and things. It removes the need of having that conversation as frequently. But obviously anchoring does help that challenge too, where you have got that step where something needs to be done, then you’ve got to have that conversation. You can’t hide from these things well, unless you do all maybe. But even then that’s really quite difficult. That’s it. So I want to flip this back a little bit. So looking at, well, I say it back, I’m actually saying forward. If we were to look ahead, how do you see the role of behavioural science evolving in the veterinary sector?

Rebecca Maher:

I’ve been asked this before and my response was probably not very helpful because behavioural science teaches us that we’re not very good at predicting, like our brains aren’t very good prediction machines. So I hesitate to give you an answer. I guess I’ll give that kind of get out so that when the future doesn’t equate to what I’ve said, then you’re already prepared for that. So yeah, we’re not good at predicting, but what I would say is that what I see happening in the industry now is a much greater awareness of the role that behavioural science has to play. Certainly there’ve been a number of keynote speakers at some of the big conferences, both in small animal and in the equine world where behavioural scientists are playing a much greater role. There are actually some behavioural science roles within veterinary businesses now that we’re starting to see.

So I think there’s sort of an awakening to the importance of not just what we communicate, but how we communicate, and simple ways in which we can help teams be much more effective at their jobs and create much better outcomes for patients and for clients, much more satisfied clients and happier teams off the back of engaging with behavioural science. So I guess what do I see looking into the future is a much deeper awareness of the role that behavioural science has got to play. And I think it will become, I hope, something which we are being taught as we go through vet school and we’re entering the profession, that behavioural science will be just another day one competency that we’re expecting people to graduate with. That would be a dream for me. But certainly I can see that that is the direction of travel, that there’s a much greater awareness already and we’re building in that direction.

Jack Peploe:

Well, Becky, your insights, they’ve offered a fascinated look at how deeper understanding of humour behaviour can significantly enhance the way veterinary practices operate and interact with their clients. If people want to get in touch with you, how do they get in touch?

Rebecca Maher:

Sure. So they can find me on LinkedIn. I’m quite active on LinkedIn, or they can head across to the Inside Minds website, which is inside minds.com.

Jack Peploe:

That’s amazing. Well, thank you so much, Becky. I really appreciate your time.

Rebecca Maher:

Thank you. Really great speaking with you, Jack. Thanks for having me.

Jack Peploe:

Pause

Jack Peploe:

For laughs.

Jack Peploe:

Each episode we add a touch of humour by inviting our guests to share their most unforgettable animal related bloopers. This time we have Mike Mossop, who takes us back to a challenging yet humorous situation involving a surprise attack during a routine house call.

Mike Mossop:

Yeah, so it’s just when you guys asked me about this one particular anecdote came to mind. So as I mentioned, I made the shift from kind of more traditional practice into mobile practice, and I still remember one of my first visits, it is different being in somebody’s home where the animals are kind of out doing their thing and in their natural environment as opposed to being in their carrier in the exam room or something like that. So we were in an appointment with two cats and we were trying to take blood on one of them. And as all of your listeners know, sometimes taking a blood sample from a cat can be challenging, but it was going really well. I was holding the cat, my technician was drawing the blood sample, and then the other cat came flying across the room at me and just latched onto my shoulder. And it’s something you would never even think of in practice because the animals are a little bit more segregated and contained. But anyway, we did, despite me having still a scar on my shoulder, we did manage to finish getting the blood sample on the first cat. Everybody was okay, but it did just, we approached the next visit when there were multiple animals a little bit differently. So just a tip for any of you

Jack Peploe:

Coming up next week on the Modern Veterinary Practice Podcast, we welcome Brian Faulkner, an accomplished veterinarian and celebrated leader in the field. Brian shares his journey from starting six veterinary practices to mastering the art of client communication and leadership within the veterinary industry. We delve into his innovative approaches to practice management, his insights on the future of veterinary medicine and the lessons he’s learned along the way. Tune in to hear Brian’s unique perspectives on combining business acumen with veterinary expertise to lead practices towards success.

Brian Faulkner:

So I guess in a nutshell, for me, building confidence is about understanding doubt and self-doubt. And you must deal with those rocky foundations before you try and build up some sort of potentially narcissistic gleeful confidence or where you’re trying to build a house on the sand.

Jack Peploe:

That’s it for this episode. All links and recommendations we talked about are in the show notes. Don’t forget to subscribe and share the podcast if you found it useful. In the meantime, thanks for listening and see you next time.